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That could also make you a rich Republican. ;)
When (if) we ever meet up, remind me to punch you square in the face.

but if there was an impression that at the school they faced a Wall of Kyosus (rhymes with Wall of Jews) if they made a complaint, then it’s reasonable they would feel they have to go around or over that wall.

Yeah, I suppose in that case, she would need to do something to counter the Wall of Kyosus, as you say (kinda like the Blue Wall of Silence, I assume). It’s not like it’s unheard of that the Wall of Kyosus has covered something up (to protect themselves? the rep of the uni? other?). A pervy foreign prof in Busan comes to mind; not fired despite numerous claims of harassment (and assault? can’t remember), then covered up.

I have a feeling her grad career is over anyway with this complaint. The academic community could circle the wagons and just shut her down if they had a mind to. A sort of Korean equivalent of Norman Finkelstein.

Interesting that nowadays it’s nearly completely the opposite in a lot of American universities: a well-supported claim of something like that could be a guarantee of being treated with kid gloves through to graduation.

Was he even being serious? What if he was being sarcastic, basically saying ‘oh why study? I’m just your professor after all? You don’t have to study under me – why don’t we go for a drink instead of doing your coursework’?

It’s not like he was saying come drink with me tonight or you’ll fail the course, and he made his comments in front of a whole class – sounds a lot more like sarcasm to me.

Doesn’t sound like sarcasm to me. Maybe because I’ve seen it before when it wasn’t.

It is rather common for professors to want to go drinking with students. Even when it isn’t sexual harassment, it doesn’t really seem professional or in anyway un-creepy.

It’s not like professors haven’t been made aware of these issues. Universities hold training seminars on sexual harassment. Offices throughout academia in Korea are abuzz with the latest stories of grad students (particularly doctoral students) leveling charges against their professors after closed-door meetings (whether these charges are true or not is a separate issue).

Professors, particularly younger ones, are nervous about the new, distanced realities of dealing with students. There is a growing litigious movement in Korea and teachers are easy targets. Therefore, one of the first pieces of advice I received was, don’t close your door if a student is in your office.

This guy was either blissfully ignorant are just plain stupid regardless of whether it was an actual come-on or a joke.

Sounds like he asked her out. Doing that once, without repetition in the face of lack of interest, is neither sexual harassment nor “degrading to women.” Can’t quite speak for Korea’s, but that is American law on the subject.

Maybe the professor-student thing is wrong, but that is a different problem. We will never get to the point where someone asking someone out is a crime, and that’s a good thing.

I think asking a student out when you are their class professor is wrong. Doing so in front of a group of students, ie peers, is even worse.

The problem is that Korean campuses are rife with these issues, and it gets worse than this particular example. Alot worse.

Disagree or not, nice to see Korea actually try in some way to give some power to women. Let’s just hope this extends to, you know, the raping of children. Heh.

Empower women? In the sense that this female student and her mother are now bigger asses than the professor. The professor was an idiot for making those remarks, but this hardly proves him a sexual predator or danger to students. Did he get fired?

I sorta agree with Clarinet and Bumsuck-

There are definitly bigger fish (fish perverts!) to fry.

But, maybe if they make an example out of him, it would slow down a few pervy professors.

Sounds like he asked her out. Doing that once, without repetition in the face of lack of interest, is neither sexual harassment

When one person is in a position of power over another, it most definitely IS sexual harassment. ANY professor who asks a (current) student of his on a date needs to be fired. Even asking ONCE is highly improper and is not in any way professional.

I still remember a case at my uni: a prof made overtures to a student while on a dig in Asia. She filed a complaint and his tenure was revoked. As it should have.

And as someone pointed out above, in Korea it’s common to see profs go out drinking with students. The difference there is that they go in (usually) large groups and include both genders, sometimes even a couple or three profs. It’s not one-on-one, it’s not sexual in its overtones, and there’s no inherent if-you-don’t-go-you-fail understanding to the offer.

Having said all that, I think it is ridiculous that the mother went to KNHRC to file her complaint. ONE case of sexual harassment against ONE professor is not a human rights issue.

Consenting adults are free to ask each other out, and likewise decline as they wish. Problem is there is a professor-student context, and if he can’t even wait until class is not in session, it’s a clear indication that he can misuse/abuse his authority as teacher later on if she rejected him.

The larger context is as a woman who has experienced this and seen other women go through the same thing, far too many unnecessary physical contact and dating propositions have taken place while class/lab work is IN session. There is an unspoken pressure to accept or not to report these incidents (“you’re just making a big deal”; “it’s no big deal to anyone but you & your oversensitivity”.)

if you do decline/report, you suffer consequences of their and that of their close associates in similar authority “paying you back” in one way or another down the line during your academic career – all because you bruised their egos and because they can within the infinite powers of their authority/tenure. This systemic oppression spreads to the pervasive & knee-jerk dismissive attitude: it’s just asking for a date, what’s wrong?, or else the few “crack” exceptions recklessly accusing non-existent harassment/rape for their own personal gains, are lumped into same group as the majority suffering in enforced silence.

There is a legal difference between sexual harassment, and something otherwise improper. Rudeness and bad judgment are not crimes as such. As I said before, it may be a status offense, but to call it harassment is incorrect.

So all those executives who get fired for sexual harassment (when they have propositioned their employees) were fired for no reason? A prof propositioning a student is no different.

The power difference is an implied threat if you don’t accept. Even if you DO refuse, you don’t know if it will ever come back and bite you in the ass. It’s sexual harassment. Any corporate harassment awareness course will say the same thing.

(and no, I’m not American, so your American laws mean nothing to me)

your American laws mean nothing to me

That could also make you a rich Republican. ;)

Having said all that, I think it is ridiculous that the mother went to KNHRC to file her complaint. ONE case of sexual harassment against ONE professor is not a human rights issue.

I’m late to the discussion, so apologies if this was covered, but if there was an impression that at the school they faced a Wall of Kyosus (rhymes with Wall of Jews) if they made a complaint, then it’s reasonable they would feel they have to go around or over that wall.

I mean, having the implicit threat of your graduate career being torpedoes doesn’t compare to the horror of having to piss in a cup, but it’s important to her. ;)

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